Environmental Issues

[Ken Anderson]

I had posted this in the weather thread as a response to some of the discussion there, but decided that I didn't want to have to ban myself for taking a weather thread off-topic, given that the environment and weather aren't the same thing. This video takes a look at various environmental activist campaigns throughout history, but does not take an anti-environmental stance (he goes too far in that direction than I would agree with). Any discussion of environmental issues, environmental activism, and so on, is on-topic here. Discussions do not have to be restricted to the topics discussed in the video, but I think you might find it interesting.

 

[Don Alaska]

The video was interesting and I agree with a lot of it. It has long been a "thing" with the Left to judge people on intentions rather than results. The Right tends to do the opposite and judge people by results rather than intentions. That makes Leftist politicians, such as Mamdani, AOC, and Bernie Sanders, more electable than those more focused on results rather than intentions. If we returned to the days of reusable bottles and such there would be a lot less litter and much less stuff in landfills

 

[Marie Miller]

The video was interesting and I agree with a lot of it. It has long been a "thing" with the Left to judge people on intentions rather than results. The Right tends to do the opposite and judge people by results rather than intentions. That makes Leftist politicians, such as Mamdani, AOC, and Bernie Sanders, more electable than those more focused on results rather than intentions. If we returned to the days of reusable bottles and such there would be a lot less litter and much less stuff in landfills

Run the numbers please and not just in your comfort zone.

 

[Mary Stetler]

The video was interesting and I agree with a lot of it. It has long been a "thing" with the Left to judge people on intentions rather than results. The Right tends to do the opposite and judge people by results rather than intentions. That makes Leftist politicians, such as Mamdani, AOC, and Bernie Sanders, more electable than those more focused on results rather than intentions. If we returned to the days of reusable bottles and such there would be a lot less litter and much less stuff in landfills

Money is what makes changes not benefit for humanity.
Climate has always changed. I know my gas burning car did not cause the end of the ice age. It is hot now but could be because of the destruction of the SA rain forests and other misuse of land, plants and animals.

 

[John Brunner]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2070846520136479224

There are many replies pointing out that "this is happening for decades. All old bridges in the Netherlands are cooled when temperature is above 23/24 Celcius. This is what they call bad engineering and maintenance. has noting to do with climate change."

The "extreme heat" temperature on the day that X comment was made was 77°F. These people are getting paid to try to destroy our lives.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2070974082615767197

 

[John Brunner]

Money is what makes changes not benefit for humanity.
Climate has always changed. I know my gas burning car did not cause the end of the ice age. It is hot now but could be because of the destruction of the SA rain forests and other misuse of land, plants and animals.

All the tree huggers are now operating chain saws in favor of Solar Farms.

 

[Marie Miller]

All of us are guilty to some degree. Drops make an ocean. But instead of looking at every angle and coming up with solutions the most squeaky wheel gets the attention.
We have geothermal and natural gas non vented fireplace which we heat the house at minus F degrees, insulation out of the xyz including garage and garage doors, garage has heat and a/c, specialty windows, … . I refuse to freeze and SO refuses to bake. Bake as in overheat. I will not wash ziplocks that had meat in them!
Hugging trees? A producing garden in a snooty neighborhood. Three Armenian Cucumbers and a loaf of whole wheat with bagel everything topping just went across the street. I took in six tattered American flags two of them Bettie’s for repair. Well, SO knows how to use a sewing machine and I like the huge flag the neighbor flies appropriately. My stuff does not go to waste with his kids and he will get three flags back for me to enjoy.
What are y’all doing?

 

[John Brunner]

All of us are guilty to some degree. Drops make an ocean. But instead of looking at every angle and coming up with solutions the most squeaky wheel gets the attention.
We have geothermal and natural gas non vented fireplace which we heat the house at minus F degrees, insulation out of the xyz including garage and garage doors, garage has heat and a/c, specialty windows, … . I refuse to freeze and SO refuses to bake. Bake as in overheat. I will not wash ziplocks that had meat in them!
Hugging trees? A producing garden in a snooty neighborhood. Three Armenian Cucumbers and a loaf of whole wheat with bagel everything topping just went across the street. I took in six tattered American flags two of them Bettie’s for repair. Well, SO knows how to use a sewing machine and I like the huge flag the neighbor flies appropriately. My stuff does not go to waste with his kids and he will get three flags back for me to enjoy.
What are y’all doing?

But what are we guilty of? There are no ill-effects whose measurement I trust. In my region, the stores have started charging for plastic bags and are giving paper bags away for free. Not all that long ago they stopped using paper bags altogether and forced us to use the plastic ones.

Bill Gates was vehemently against nuclear power until it was the only viable energy source from some of his data canters, and now he is a big fan.

Just stop. We are not that stupid.

edit to add: Not directed at you, @Marie Miller

 

[Marie Miller]

But what are we guilty of? There are no ill-effects whose measurement I trust. In my region, the stores have started charging for plastic bags and are giving paper bags away for free. Not all that long ago they stopped using paper bags altogether and forced us to use the plastic ones.

Bill Gates was vehemently against nuclear power until it was the only viable energy source from some of his data canters, and now he is a big fan.

Just stop. We are not that stupid.

edit to add: Not directed at you, @Marie Miller

John, we buy packaged goods, take away food ( not me), load vegetables/fruit into plastic bags, use trash bags, … .
Bill Gates should mind a lot of his projects.

 

[John Brunner]

John, we buy packaged goods, take away food ( not me), load vegetables/fruit into plastic bags, use trash bags, … .
Bill Gates should mind a lot of his projects.

I was a long-time member of of Nadar's Center for Science in the Public Interest back in the 80s-90s. Lots of good information through those guys (Nutrition Action Health Letter.) As such, I was an early adopter of canvas shopping bags they sold. They just get too funky to be reused. I want to put my produce in something clean. I guess you're point is landfills and stuff that does not degrade. I try to reuse boxes and bags, and most stores have a Recycle bin for their shopping bags (but I don't know if the net energy consumed/saved is worth it.)

I think the appliance industry needs a long, hard look. We all know what's happened to the lifecycle of washers, dryers and refrigerators. The problem is that we all buy based on price, plus I don't know how a business can survive if their product is only purchased every couple of decades (or longer.) It was different when serving an exploding (Boomer) population. They gotta make money or they cannot exist to make the products we need.

Regarding "Climate Change"...there's too much BS for me to believe any of it.

 

[Marie Miller]

I was a long-time member of of Nadar's Center for Science in the Public Interest back in the 80s-90s. Lots of good information through those guys (Nutrition Action Health Letter.) As such, I was an early adopter of canvas shopping bags they sold. They just get too funky to be reused. I want to put my produce in something clean. I guess you're point is landfills and stuff that does not degrade. I try to reuse boxes and bags, and most stores have a Recycle bin for their shopping bags (but I don't know if the net energy consumed/saved is worth it.)

I think the appliance industry needs a long, hard look. We all know what's happened to the lifecycle of washers, dryers and refrigerators. The problem is that we all buy based on price, plus I don't know how a business can survive if their product is only purchased every couple of decades (or longer.) It was different when serving an exploding (Boomer) population. They gotta make money or they cannot exist to make the products we need.

Regarding "Climate Change"...there's too much BS for me to believe any of it.

John, I have had LL Bean canvas bags with long handles since prior to Desert Storm. During Covid commissaries refused using them. I quit going there.
My KitchenAid has been in use daily for almost 30 years.
Washer was replaced about 15 years ago. Dryer is at least 25 but all it handles is towels, pillow covers and liners.