Search Or Research Each Utterance

Discussion in 'Comments on Forum' started by Frank Sanoica, Jan 7, 2019.

  1. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Veteran Member
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    Every forum seems to have one, some many, self-proclaimed experts (though not claiming so) who question statements as though they live for only that.

    Most every pronouncement I make is drawn from memory, so of course errors happen. In thinking this over when questioned extensively about "source", I've concluded that with the time spent doing normal forum "things", would I have to research every utterance, I could be spending 30 hours per day on forums. Thus, I rarely argue a point, a fact some may dispute! Go ahead! I can take it.

    Frank
     
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  2. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Greeter
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    Mostly, people do that when they want an easy win or to derail a discussion. If they can burden you with a string of unnecessary tasks, then you'll eventually give up, granting them the win. If you should decide to follow the path that they are setting for you, they hope to still get a win because most people won't follow a long, drawn-out discussion, particularly when a bunch of other stuff is inserted into the mix while you're putting together your citations. If you come back with a citation, it will either be ignored or another demand will be made.

    A forum should be somewhat like a personal conversation. If you tell me something that I don't believe, I might tell you that I don't believe you, depending on whether I really want to go there, but I won't send you off to the library to bring back a stack of books to prove your point. Of course, people who have such facts at hand are likely to be more persuasive but, even in personal conversations, people's opinions are rarely changed so it's not always worth the effort.
     
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  3. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    Love your post Frank
    I agree and would like our discussions to be more like the 'Cheers' bar - not too heavy :p

    [​IMG]
     
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  4. Thomas Stearn

    Thomas Stearn Very Well-Known Member
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    I don't know what incident you are referring to precisely. I didn't ask (you) for evidence but sometimes I would. ;)

    Asking for evidence is not necessarily a malicious strategy to derail a discussion although sometimes it may be, e.g. when you are talking to a troll. Let's think of the alternative, i.e., when asking for evidence would be a no-go. That would mean that anyone can just claim anything without ever having to give evidence, no matter how odd a statement may be, erroneously assuming that listeners just have to buy into everything someone alleges. So, it would very much depend on the kind of statement made.

    To my mind, we need to differentiate between personal statements like "I've been to Idaho." for which no evidence is needed and statements like "Americans have never had it so good in the history of this country." or "People are getting increasingly tired of going to the polls." or "In order to end WWII in Europe neither the US forces nor their lend-lease equipment to its allies were needed." which, for different reasons, all call for an explanation, for examples, for evidence to substantiate each of them if a conversation is to be meaningful.

    We need to ask ourselves: What are the implications if we leave certain assertions unchallenged? In the case of "having been to Idaho" there are hardly any whereas other statements may be identified as an attempt of questioning established knowledge and may be indicative of a hidden agenda. As legitimate as this is, it would at least require some sort of rationale.

    Another aspect is the forumites themselves. Not all of them want to persuade other people. Sometimes it may be enough just to indicate that there may be different views and then leave it at that. After all, everybody needs to decide for themselves whether or not an exchange of ideas is worth the time spent.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  5. Lulu Moppet

    Lulu Moppet Very Well-Known Member
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    Beautifully said, Herr Stearn.
     
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  6. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    Depends on the subject and its importance, I guess
     
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  7. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Veteran Member
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    @Patsy Faye hit the proverbial nail on the head.
    There are areas of conversation that do indeed call for some exploration for the facts and others do not.
    Some things are personal concepts and opinion whilst other topics of conversation are informative such as historical events, scientific development, engineering, law, etc.

    In any event, people choose which topic on a forum they wish to join and there are topics such as the political, religious, or science formats that call for both speculative philosophy and hard core facts and one should not be confused with the other.
    If I write that something is fact, then I should be willing to back that statement up with evidence which supports my statement.
    If, on the other hand, I am merely speculating or theorizing it is simply a part of conversation and should be taken as such.
    Example: If one states that the Bible says that “God helps those who help themselves” I am going to ask where that statement is located because in short, it doesn’t exist.
    Now, if someone says that the Bible sort of indicates that God helps those who help themselves, we have a completely different type of subject matter for indeed, it becomes a matter of excellent speculation bent on good conversation.
     
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  8. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    @Bobby Cole - I've noticed you 'hit the nail on the head' better than I do Bobby :) Great post
     
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  9. Tex Dennis

    Tex Dennis Very Well-Known Member
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    Last year I read an article on this I wish I remembered where about those who post on forums and patterns seen with them it was so very true, to me anyway, from those with very sparse profiles and never a picture and love to create negatives and problems with others to the opposite with info pictures and all being the best, on another site I read on this is so true it is scary for a certain segment of them, I will try to find the article as it hit the mark well, very well! Anyone else seen that?
     
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  10. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Veteran Member
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    @Bobby Cole “God helps those who help themselves”

    At risk of placing your view of my position in jeopardy (again), I reveal that my Dad interpreted that statement to mean God supports thievery.

    Frank
     
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  11. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    #11
  12. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Veteran Member
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    Then, sticking with the OP mind you, one would have to review the actual verse of Ex 20:15 whereby it plainly states that “thou shalt not steal”.
    If one did in fact believe that God supports thievery based on an illegitimate Biblical claim, then the above verse would have to be cited as reference in order to prevent a theological paradox.

    OR
    If we review the state of human existence with some light hearted banter, whereby we acknowledge that it is stated that God looks out for fools and drunks, it is not too far of a stretch to include the opinion that thieves are also highly honored by the same entity.
     
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  13. Tex Dennis

    Tex Dennis Very Well-Known Member
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    I understood it correctly here. Pull your own load in life.
     
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  14. Lulu Moppet

    Lulu Moppet Very Well-Known Member
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    came across this while researching the saying [​IMG]
     
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  15. Shirley Martin

    Shirley Martin Veteran Member
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    I'm sure that all of our Islamic members will be quite impressed by that post.
     
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