Ken Is In The Hot Seat

Discussion in 'Personal Diaries' started by Terry Page, Apr 8, 2016.

  1. Shirley Martin

    Shirley Martin Veteran Member
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    Ken, I am unfamiliar with the word "Anabaptist". I Googled it to learn more about it. I read the Wikipedia information about it. I saw that there are several different denominations but they agree on the basic beliefs. A lot of it was over my head but I gathered these things from it:

    They don't bear arms against anyone or strike back if attacked in any way.
    They don't take part in any government; render unto Caesar, etc.
    They don't have a preacher as such. A member of the congregation speaks as he/she feels called upon to speak.
    They don't take oaths of any kind.

    Does this describe the things you practice? Can you tell us more?
     
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  2. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    Okay, let's give this another shot as maybe I wasn't clear in what I was trying to ask you. If you were elected President in November and you could choose your Vice President, who would you choose (name please). And if you could change things without having to go through the House and Senate..what would be the first things you would change?
     
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  3. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    Does Michelle share your faith and beliefs? Do you believe that miracles, healing, etc. are just as real today as they were when Jesus Christ walked the earth and brought them forth?
     
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  4. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    Unfortunately, no. I haven't heard from him in quite a while. He moved out when he turned eighteen, then moved back in a few months later when he couldn't pay his rent, and stayed with me until he was twenty. At that time, he married a girl who he had dated in high school and I moved from California to Texas, paying the rent up on my townhouse in California for six months to give them a start. He came with me to Texas to help me move, and he and his wife drove to Texas another time to visit. The last time I saw him, I had flown to California to visit. At that time, he had his first baby. Seemingly, he has never gone online or I think I'd have found him, but I've moved several times since then, as I suspect he has as well, since people tend not to stay in one place for too long in Orange County. When I was getting started in EMS, that was my focus and I have never been very good at keeping in touch with people until Facebook. He will be fifty-three in July, so he's old enough to be here now.

    No, except with the technical stuff. When people are having trouble connecting, getting emails or not getting emails, there is really very little that I can do about it other than see if my web host can figure out what the problem might be. I connect to the forum in the same way that the rest of you do, the only difference being that my Admin account allows me to access the back-end stuff, none of which controls whether someone will get a bad connection or a good one. Actually, there is a setting that I can use to discourage people that fakes a bad connection, but I swear I have only used that on a couple of spammers. When I ban their account or ISP, they just create another account or come in on a proxy, but when I set it to discourage, they think they can't get a connection and go away. That's the idea, anyhow.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 10, 2016
  5. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    That's a correct definition except that it doesn't -- or no longer -- applies to all Anabaptist groups. Anabaptist is a generic term that is used to describe a variety of denominations that includes the Mennonites, Hutterites, and Amish. Some of the modern Mennonite groups consider themselves to be Protestant but, traditionally, the Anabaptists came out of the Radical Reformation, which took place simultaneous or just a little later than the Protestant Reformation, but while the Protestant Reformation was still going on. The early Anabaptist groups fit the description that you found, but then broke off to form several other sub-sects, including the Mennonites, Old Order Mennonites, Amish, Hutterites, and others, including subsets of these. In the early days of both Reformations, some of the leading people who formed the first Baptist groups had an association with the Anabaptists, so that's where there was a form of mingling between the Protestant and Radical Reformations. Once Protestant groups, such as the Lutherans, attained political power in Europe, they began to persecute the Anabaptists as well, while there was little movement on the part of the Anabaptists to form political affiliations. There was one group of Anabaptists who attempted such, but they were quickly severed from the larger group of Anabaptists.

    Simply speaking, the Old Order Mennonites, most of the Amish groups, and the Hutterites are similar in that they have decided not to embrace modernization. Contrary to popular belief however, this is not a religious belief on their part, but a choice that they have made as a body, intended to make it easier for them to remain the type of Christians they seek to be, and there are several types of Amish groups, separated largely by the the technologies that they have agreed to accept.

    I was a member of a Church of the Brethren congregation, which is one of the more modern Mennonite denominations, with no bars to the use of technology. They were more or less neutral as far as participation in government, such as voting, although there were some in the church who strongly believed that a Christian should not hold public office or serve in the military. We did have a pastor, but it was significant that the pastor was expected to hold another job. When there were projects and programs that he was needed for, the church reimbursed him for his time, in lieu of a salary, but otherwise he worked as a plumber.

    Since I was last able to participate in a Church of the Brethren congregation, as there were none near me in Texas and there are none near me here in Maine, that denomination has split over the subject of gay marriage and over gays serving in church positions.

    I am very familiar with the history and various beliefs of the Anabaptists and am perfectly willing to participate in a thread about it in the religion section. I have never been Amish but I have several friends who are, or were, and am on good terms with the Amish community nearest us here in Maine. I am less familiar with the Hutterites as far as having personal relationships but I have studied the denomination, and have had one friend who was raised in a Hutterite community.

    Ron Paul. Or Michigan Congressman Justin Amash. As far as changes, I would first undo every law that was put into force by executive action, then go back to operating as a constitutional republic, which does include the House and Senate.

    Not exactly, as she has no familiarity with Anabaptism, other than what we have discussed. She is a Christian, and a much stronger Christian than I am. I believe that Jesus has the power to do whatever He wants to do, but that He chooses to work within the laws of nature that were established by God in most cases. In other words, since mankind has messed up nature, we have cancer. I believe that God may, and probably does, heal people of cancer from time to time, but that He does so because He has a special purpose for that person, and not because someone laid hands upon them or prayed for healing. Don't misunderstand this, however. I do believe that God may work through the laying on of hands now as He did during New Testament times, and I believe in the power of prayer. Still, I believe that two people might have an equal number of faithful people praying for them to be healed, yet one might be healed and another not. We cannot always understand God's purposes or plans.

    Unless God has some special purpose for me, one that can't be just as easily accomplished by someone else, if I step out in front of a truck, my life or death is more likely to be controlled by the reaction time of the truck driver, rather than by my position in the body of Christ.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 10, 2016
  6. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    Okay last question. How much of a part would you say Faith has in healing?
     
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  7. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    I have to say that it can have very much, but it usually has very little. Mostly, God provides the ability for a person to remain well through healthy foods and healthy living, and that He heals through doctors, medicine and yes, through natural remedies. At times, He may choose to heal someone based on prayer or faith, but I don't believe that poor health is the result of a lack of faith or that the reverse is true. That said, there is a natural benefit to having faith that a particular procedure, medication, or religious rite may heal you. That's the placebo effect, and it can lead to actual healings.
     
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  8. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    Well I do have to admit if you are going to ask the question then you better be prepared for any answer....but I do have to admit I am somewhat surprised in your answer here. But what doesn't surprise me is your honesty....thank you.
     
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  9. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    It may be a reaction to my mother's death at an early age. She was a very Christian woman in every way that I am aware of. Yet, when she was in, I think, her early forties, she went into the hospital and died a few days later of a stroke. I was a new Christian at the time and like, I am sure, everyone else in my family and a lot of other Christians in our extended family and community, I prayed that she would get well, and come home from the hospital. At that time, the hospital policies were that no one under the age of eighteen could visit and, unlike my older brothers, I was not allowed to visit her during her last days on earth. Nevertheless, I believed strongly in the power of prayer and actually felt confident that God would hear my prayers and heal my mother. When that didn't happen, I was mad at God for a long while, and finally realized that He is not at our command and doesn't necessarily heed our prayers. He hears them, I am sure, but the chances of any particular prayer being answered in the way that it was asked is about the same as casting dice.

    I have trouble listening to preaching from the pulpit about God healing those who have enough faith, since the implications are that my mother didn't have enough faith or that our prayers were, for some reason, deficient.

    This may sound like a harsh thing but God's concerns are not so much one of ensuring that we lead a healthy, happy life here on earth. Certainly, Christ did not grant this to His disciples, the ones who walked with Him while He was here in human form, so why should He now be sitting in heaven healing us whenever we get ourselves into trouble? The Apostle Paul was certainly a faithful man, yet he suffered from afflictions. Among them, the Apostle John was perhaps the only one to live into old age, and his life was certainly not on Easy Street.

    So no, I don't believe in the easy Gospel, that if only one can have enough faith, everything will come up roses. More often, the reverse is true. We are tested through adversity and afflictions, and Christ tells us that we will be hated for His sake.

    As a human being, I have surely prayed to be healed from cancer and from other things that have come upon me. I have prayed for jobs, for money, and for other things that I thought I needed here on earth, and I have asked others to pray for these things as well. I pray regularly for others who are in need and, as a paramedic, I prayed for the skill and the wisdom to do the right thing. God does hear our prayers, I believe, and there's always a chance that He will answer them in the way we'd like Him to. As a Christian though, my overriding concerns should look beyond the comforts of this life and to the one beyond. I can't say that I do that all of the time, or even most of the time, but that is my failing.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 10, 2016
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  10. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    You owed me no explanation for your beliefs Ken...but I thank you for sharing them anyway. That is the honesty which brought me to this Forum in the first place. A place where we could be honest and open with each other...and accept our sameness as well as our differences in our beliefs and opinions without judgement or criticism. I understand what you are saying and I definitely know what is it to be mad at God.

    There is no easy Gospel with Jesus...in fact if anyone decides to follow Him they are guaranteed a life of trials and tribulation in this world. And yet they are also guaranteed that their suffering, etc. will not be in vain. Every day of our lives is written in the Book of Life and our days are also numbered and God knows every one of those days that we will have on this earth. Even when we pray we are to say "God's will be done in our lives...and He doesn't always heal on this earth...but His children are healed in eternal life and that is the life that is really important. So should we not ask in faith that we be healed? We should always take to our Lord whatever is on our hearts...and then after asking we should trust His will to be done...in heaven as it is on earth. Faith does play a part though or Jesus would not have spoken so many times about faith...and the fact that if we had faith as small as a mustard seed...we could move the mountains in our lives. But even what we see as a mountain may be God's ways that are higher than our ways to understand. And we have to accept that part too. It may be that your earthly days will come to an end with the cancer that is trying to destroy you or it may be that satan is telling you his lies because he wants to kill, steal, or destroy your life here on this earth. I only know this...faith in God beats the lies of satan everytime and will not take a minute of your earthly life that God has written in His Book of Life unless you believe satan's lies over God's Truth.

    And as for Paul...he prayed that God would remove that "thorn in his side" and God told him he would not remove that thorn because in Paul's weakness God's strength was shown.
     
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  11. Linda Binning

    Linda Binning Well-Known Member
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    Thank you for your answers Ken. Well, maybe some day your son will join the majority of the the US and get on FB. Or do one of those internet searches and find you. We found a tall handsome smart cousin we had back in the 50s and 60s and he was on FB but somehow he's been replaced with some old wrinkled man with a PHd who has written several books that I couldn't even pronounce the name of. My brother and I felt to intimidated to even try to contact him. I hope it goes better for you and your son.
     
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  12. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    In New Testament times, miracles and healing were used as a means of gaining the peoples' attention so that the Gospel might be preached. I don't know that Jesus healed the blind man so that the blind man could see, but so that everyone who witnessed the event would be able to see more clearly the message that He was preaching. His disciples also, used miracles as a way of getting attention.

    I don't know if Benny Hinn is still around because I haven't had television in a while, but I have always viewed people like Benny Hinn as entertainment and not as a genuine man of God. I know that I shouldn't, but I am always skeptical of pastors and evangelists who claim to heal by the laying on of hands. Although I have no reason to believe that miracles are not for today, yet my automatic response to someone being healed through a laying on of hands is one of doubt and skepticism, and I have no doubt that many -- if not most -- of them are fake.

    When I was a kid, each summer the tent revival meetings would come to town. Usually, being a conservative community, the ones who came to Wallace were more standard revival circuit preachers, bringing a message not unlike that which we could hear from the pulpit in our church, only ratcheted up several decibels on the emotional scale. One year however, we got a revival preacher there who set aside a portion of the service for people to come up and be healed, or simply to be knocked to the ground.

    Indeed, there were a few people who claimed to have been healed of whatever ailed them after the preacher laid his hands upon them, and were able to walk although they had come up in a wheelchair. The problem was that pretty much everyone in the audience was related to one another, and none of us knew any of those who came up to be healed. The consensus was that they were part of the show, that they traveled with the revival circuit to be healed in town after town after town, hoping to entice someone who was really sick to come for the same.
     
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  13. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    Well Ken...I don't believe I ever said anything about "laying hands" on you for your healing...although it does say in the New Testament that if anyone of you who are sick then you should go to the Church Elders and let them anoint you with oil for healing and lay their hands on you and pray for healing, etc. The only problem with this now days from my point of view...is that it's really hard to find the "Church Elders" that the Disciples of the New Testament were talking about in churches today. You would be better off finding a few "faith" filled Christians to lay those hands on you and anoint you with oil if that is what you feel you need. Now days I would spend my time asking God to give me that faith as "small as a mustard seed to move that mountain in my life". There are a lot of people and churches of every denomination calling themselves Christian now days...and even a lot of christs and gods impersonating the real ones too. But Jesus says that His sheep know His voice and follow Him...alone...no matter what others say or do. What others may consider a miracle now days...I just feel is God and Jesus keeping their promises to those who believe by faith and God's will for them. They never promised us a "rose garden" only salvation and "eternal" life.
     
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  14. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    How about a picture of you and Michelle when you got married or your early days together. I want to see that woman that has faith enough for the two of you...and my slow internet won't let me load the videos with you both in them.
     
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  15. Shirley Martin

    Shirley Martin Veteran Member
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    I believe that God answers prayers. Sometimes the answer is, "No".

    Ken, on a scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate your sense of humor? My favorite form of humor is one that is a play on words. What would you say yours is?
     
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  16. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    I'd say maybe an eight, only people don't generally know when I'm joking. I enjoy sarcasm but sarcasm is generally mean so I try not to do that so much. I usually go with something subtle. No smileys if it's online, no smiles in person. If they get that it's a joke great; otherwise, that's funny too.
     
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  17. Shirley Martin

    Shirley Martin Veteran Member
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    What is the funniest joke you ever heard?
     
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  18. Avigail David

    Avigail David Well-Known Member
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    For about 7 years (2003-2010), we've had very warm, good, wonderful like-minded inter-state get-togethers with the Anabaptist groups here at home, and at their main church conferences/meetings in their state. We've lost touch now that our families got older and left home. I recall not having to do with sports, politics, and 'worldly fashion' which I agreed with.

    Our family now is in our new chapters of our lives. No sad regrets. But a moving forward in the direction where God sees us as an individual family recognizing our Christian heritage from way way past Martin Luther's Reformation--back to the ancient Hebraic foundation of the Christian faith. :)
     
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  19. Avigail David

    Avigail David Well-Known Member
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    It's so nice to be a part of this group and see, a glimpse, of who our SCO founder/moderator is in 'person' :)
     
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