Is It Possible To Be Christian And Pro-choice At The Same Time?

Discussion in 'Faith & Religion' started by Babs Hunt, Jan 25, 2017.

  1. Denise Happyfeet

    Denise Happyfeet Very Well-Known Member
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    True @Babs Hunt it's best as you know I'm sure, to read it in context. Everything in there is interwoven with other things in the bible to help us understand the Word. There's are real chance of misunderstanding if taken out of context.
     
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  2. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    I think that's true about some alot of what is written in God's Word Denise. But there is also alot that God says that stands alone and means exactly what He said. :) It's people who try to make it mean something else most of the time so they can do things their way....instead of God's.

    And I can say this in all honesty...because at one time I tried to do this too.
     
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  3. Yvonne Smith

    Yvonne Smith Greeter
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    When abortions were not legalized, women still aborted their babies, and have done this since the beginning, using herbs, or whatever means that they had to stop an unwanted pregnancy. In more recent times, many women died from unlicensed doctors in secret abortion clinics that were neither safe nor sanitary.
    Sometimes women have carried babies that were the result of them being raped or molested, and I do not think that any woman should be forced to go through either of these things.
    I think that this is (my understanding) what @Patsy Faye is saying, and I agree with her completely. I think that each person has their morals and beliefs, and this is not respective of their religious beliefs, or lack of such.
    What I am against is having the abortion clinics that are leaving the baby grow until it is almost fully developed and then harvesting organs, and I don't think there is EVER any just reason for doing this.
    This IS actually killing babies, in my opinion.
    I also think that @Chrissy Cross has brought up an important distinction here, and that is that women (some of them are undoubtedly pregnant) and innocent babies and children are killed all of the time as part of wars (most of them our invasions of other countries), and I think that this is even worse than someone terminating a pregnancy when there is a reason for doing so. Yet, we never see protestors marching and carrying signs about that, and even most Christians never give it a second thought.
    The Bible is full of stories where the armies were told to destroy all women and children, and even sometimes the livestock, when they invaded a country.
     
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  4. Denise Happyfeet

    Denise Happyfeet Very Well-Known Member
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    That is the way the world has not only been with the bible, but what anybody says, or writes. I think some genuinely misunderstand, but yes, there are those that add to or take away from the true meaning. The bible says New International Version
    "The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit." (my blue highliting)

    This is an amazing part of the bible for me. I can also relate it to someone that maybe misunderstands a speech by someone, or just a conversation. If you truly KNOW the person that wrote it or spoke the words, you know exactly what they mean, because you know the person.

    Here's a good example, I have a close friend and we tease back and forth. I was carrying a big load of groceries from my truck and she asked me if I had the time. If I didn't understand, and know she was pullin a joke on me, I could think "is she blind"!! But I know her so I just got her back by saying up yours, and we both had a good laugh;)
     
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  5. Denise Happyfeet

    Denise Happyfeet Very Well-Known Member
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    I don't understand why the baby should pay for the crime with it's life.

    It again boils down to what is a life, and what is some sort of blob of protoplasm?
     
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  6. Chrissy Cross

    Chrissy Cross Veteran Member
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    I agree, and even though I consider myself pro choice I would like to see abortion restricted to the earliest a woman finds out. I would say 12 weeks at the latest. If I had to have an abortion I would want it done at 6 weeks, I'd have missed my period and would know by then if I was pregnant.

    I've never been for abortion as a means of birth control. Also, even if roe vs wade is ever overturned, women who want one will find a way. They did before and they will again.
     
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  7. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    Yes, Yvonne women did still "murder" their babies before that "murdering" was legalized. But that doesn't mean it wasn't murder than or now. It will never be anything but murder no matter how you try to make it in to something else.

    There will never be a right reason for murdering the child growing in their womb.
     
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  8. Chrissy Cross

    Chrissy Cross Veteran Member
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    We can argue this forever and women that want abortions will have them and women that don't...won't.

    Some of these unwanted babies will be murdered (as you call it) before they are born but how many unwanted babies are killed after they've known life?? Those are the ones that break my heart.

    The neglected ones and abused ones.

    And with that I'm out of here....abortion is not my issue, don't want one, don't need one and never had one.
     
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  9. Janice Martin

    Janice Martin Well-Known Member
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    I don't mean to veer your thread in a different direction, but isn't it only logical (on this topic and many others) that while there always were and will always be people who do wrong, MORE do it when they're told it's 'safe, legal, and acceptable'?
    I'm sure there were plenty of women with unplanned pregnancies before Roe v Wade who could have found a 'back alley butcher' but didn't, simply because it was not presented as 'safe, legal, and acceptable.'
     
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  10. Yvonne Smith

    Yvonne Smith Greeter
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    Well said, , and a great point, @Janice Martin . There have usually been other alternatives, like having the baby and adopting it out. That might not have been an option in other time periods when babies were often thrown out when they were born in some cultures (especially girl babies); but now there are places where unwed mothers can stay and have their baby and then put it out for adoption.
    Standing outside of an abortion clinic waving a protest sign is not likely to save the babies. Helping those teen girls to find a safe place to live and deliver the baby is a much better idea. Maybe if the teenage mothers had to spend nine months being pregnant they would think a little more before going right back out and getting pregnant again. As Chrissy said, abortion should not ever be used as a form of birth control.
    And it does seem like emphasis is put on the baby being born, and then the child living in neglect and abuse is often overlooked, (as @Chrissy Cross mentioned), even by Christian churches , who could be doing something to help the situation and not just complaining about it.
    Nothing is sadder than seeing those children who are abused and mistreated by their parents, when the parents should not have had children in the first place.
    Helping to see these babies placed in loving adoptive homes would be a great improvement over either having them aborted, or being raised by unloving parents.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 25, 2017
  11. Ina I. Wonder

    Ina I. Wonder Very Well-Known Member
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    For many this is a religious dilemma, and for some it is a moral issue. The two are not necessarily the same.

    I know many Christians, and there are many opinions amongst them concerning abortion. Christianity is not the only religion that deals with this very question.

    Many people are not religious, but they still have morals. This tells me morals come from within each of us.

    I was taught that no matter what others might say, that I should always hear what my Creator was telling me. That each of us can speak directly to The Creator within ourselves. As long as I listen to my Creator, I find whatever the issue is, there is always a clear answer.

    At the age of 13, 11 months after I was married, I was told by my doctor that I was pregnant, and that I should not have the child. He said my health was at risk, and he adviced that I abort the pregnancy as early as possible. My husband was all for that. He was in his mid 40's, and didn't want 'more' children. I was 13, and I didn't want a baby either. But the voice of my Creator said this was wrong.

    My first pregnancy was only 8 months, and at 15, the same thing happened, and that child was born after only 6&1/2 months. The doctors said I was lucky and should not have anymore children. I had no more children.

    So for me it was a moral issue. My Creator told me that no matter how much I didn't want to have children, it would be wrong to "kill" my children.

    So although both of my sons are gone now, they were my greatest treasures.

    Not all morals come from religion.
     
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  12. Chrissy Cross

    Chrissy Cross Veteran Member
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    I wanted both my children, abortion was never an issue, it wasn't because of religion or even morals that contributed to that decision. After I decided a girl and a boy was all I wanted, I had my tubes tied at 27. It was done because I had ABO incompatibility with my son. His bilirubin was too high at birth but they got it down in the hospital and he was ready to come home with me. The issue was I was type O and my son got his fathers blood type B and my body was producing antibodies against his blood...or something like that.

    The dr said any pregnancy after would be risky...stillbirths, etc....so, since I really didn't want more children anyway
    It was an easy decision. I knew I could devote lots of time to raising only 2 children and 5 years apart at that.

    And...it all worked out wonderfully in the end.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 25, 2017
  13. Janice Martin

    Janice Martin Well-Known Member
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    Ina: I agree with most of what you said in your post, but not the part that I bolded. While I've known many people over the decades who either follow other religions or none at all and have led highly moral lives, I don't believe genuine morals can come from within a person- if it didn't come from their religions, it came from their families or similar solid sources.

    As a generally-accepted definition is 'the standards of right/wrong,' I think the approach that it comes from each person reduces it to personal choice, which is much different.
     
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  14. Ina I. Wonder

    Ina I. Wonder Very Well-Known Member
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    @Janice Martin , I can not say you are wrong. All I can go by are my own experiences. I was raised by selfish parents, and foster parents. They were physically and emotionally abusive to me, and I was married/sold off at 13. So I didn't recieve any form of good religious, family, or solid sources to form my morals by.

    At the age of six, I truly believed I was about to die, but a voice inside told me to hold on. I spent a week in the hospital, but I lived. Other times I've had to makes life choices, and I would get so confused, until I would quiet myself and listen for the voice within me. No one taught me how to do this.

    Many times I didn't like the answer I would find, but I've never regretted following that voice.

    I taught myself how to listen past what I might want. Then I was lucky to meet my Native American grandmother, and with her guidance I learned to believe in, and get a better understanding of The Creator.

    In my 20's I read many religions, but this only caused me confusion. I've only felt I was doing right when I followed that voice, and I believe it to be The Creator.
     
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  15. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    I have experienced this too Ina - I truly believe when a child is alone emotionally, there is that voice that comforts them
    it had a huge impact on my life and was a big help to me getting through it all
     
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