How Does Your Country Respond To Bigotry And Hatred?

Discussion in 'Politics & Government' started by Billie Lane, Apr 9, 2017.

  1. Billie Lane

    Billie Lane Member
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  2. Holly Saunders

    Holly Saunders Veteran Member
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    errrrm...not the British way....maybe just the Birmingham way.
     
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  3. Billie Lane

    Billie Lane Member
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    After the London atrocities the Muslim community made a public demonstration of Unity against Terrorism.
    I currently live in Preston, and regular unity projects are held there, so this is not only Birmingham. these incidents are seldom publicised because thet are not sensational, but they are many and varied.
     
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  4. Gloria Mitchell

    Gloria Mitchell Very Well-Known Member
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    At one time, naive that I was, thought this whole... I hate you because - thing was brought about just before my birth. However, after a few documentaries, and some reading- it has been going on Forever....therefore I think,it may never end.
    I love it, when some nit wit, starts bad mouthing the black people --- I say here, let me show you all of great grand children..all biracial - that usually shuts them up. I have to laugh at stupidity about race...the fact remains- we all are a Heinz 57 as they use to say. There is no such thing as a Pure bred human. Just say'en ...:D
     
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  5. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    America to me is no different from other Countries @Billie Lane. There are those who are bigots and feel hate towards people they don't agree with or understand and there are those who show love and acceptance too. But like you said...the News Media only likes to show the worst and not the best.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  6. Missy Lee

    Missy Lee Well-Known Member
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    Here in Canada things are getting antsy. Anti Muslim groups are forming and petitions are flying. It's been over a year now since our Prime Minister opened his arms to refugees and now that the money is running out so is support. And yet this dumbo leader we have thinks Canada should bring more in.

    You can't blame people for getting angry. I live in an area with a population of around 200,000 and 15,000 of those are Muslim. Their demands are becoming more and more frequent and I fear that nothing will stop them until we are all praying with our butts in the air facing east.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-far-right-soldiers-of-odin-1.3896175
     
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  7. Babs Hunt

    Babs Hunt Veteran Member
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    We have plenty of that going on here too and most Americans are not happy about this either.
     
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  8. Yvonne Smith

    Yvonne Smith Very Well-Known Member
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    I think that a country's first responsibility is to their own people, and then if we can help other people in/from other countries, we should do that. To me, it is like , as a parent, we are responsible for taking care of our own children first, making sure that they have food and clothing (and love) and then helping other less-fortunate children who need food or new clothes.
    I think that a lot of what is termed "racial hatred" is being fostered on the general public by both the government and the news media. We live in an area with a variety of nationalities, and everyone shops together, and gets along just fine with their neighbors, irrespective of their race.
    The problems come in when people are demanding rights more than other people, just because of their race. This should not be happening, no matter what a person's race is. And if you live next door to someone who is a thief or a trouble maker, and you do not get along, it is because of their behavior and not their race.
     
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  9. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Very Well-Known Member
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    Everyone in the world, and not just America, dislikes bigotry and the exposed bigot. But, no matter the view point on the subjects of race, gender, religion or politics anyone can be regarded as a bigot by someone with an opposing stance.

    I say I dislike BLM, the Black Panthers, and the NAACP therefore I MUST be against all black people. I like seeing women on an equal playing field with men, but since I oppose most aspects of abortion I must be a bigot.
    Even though I associate very well with a whole conglomeration of races and religions, but because I am for stronger borders and against ILLEGAL aliens being allowed into my country, I am a bigot to someone.

    In order to get along with everyone a person needs to stand in the middle of the figurative road and blind folded so as not to see what is going on around them. They have to agree with whichever way the traffic is going and never flinch at the squeal of breaks or the oft time speeding vehicle.
    The problem with standing in the middle and having no personal beliefs is that at some time or other, someone on either side of the road is going to hit you.

    Sadly, we're all bigots to someone especially if you hate trying to be politically correct. It just depends on who you ask.
     
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  10. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    @Billie Lane
    I must admit to ignorance here. The portrayal in the link escapes my abilities to understand. Basically, is it stating that Muslim beliefs run contrary to the generally-accepted concepts of humans accepting humans, reacting to differing cultural mores with tolerance and understanding, condoning personal decency?
    Frank
     
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  11. Terry Page

    Terry Page Very Well-Known Member
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    That's my experience as well @Yvonne Smith , in my home town we have always had various groups of people from different races/nationalities, it used to be Indian, Caribbean and Italian after WWII.

    The Italians have now left and we have a sizeable Polish community and a recent Muslim one, but we all live in harmony, with very few disputes, despite all the lies and hype peddled by our largely corrupt media run by bigots, especially a couple of awful newspapers who shall remain nameless, who love to stir up both racial and nationalistic issues for their own nefarious ends.

    I have stayed with many Muslim, Hindu and Christian families during my travels, and though they each have their own rules and rituals, they have never tried to impose them on me. Also outside of the tourist industry, they seem to live side by side in harmonious communities.


    Yes I agree @Gloria Mitchell we are all mixed race in reality, and because I feel these racial/nationalistic prejudices come from a primitive part of our brains, dating back to tribal/survival times, we are unlikely to change until the human race evolves beyond this basically animal function of our psyche.......
     
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  12. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Very Well-Known Member
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    To me, human bias toward race, religion, etc is simply an opaque overlay of the true reality of the tendency all of us have of feeling somehow superior to someone else. No matter the country or township a sort of caste system is in play which designates how high up on the proverbial totem pole a person is situated. The higher up a person is, the more people he or she can look down upon. i.e. white collar versus blue collar or highly educated versus apprentice based or OJT knowledge and training.

    A good example might be a forum my wife and I left about a year ago which is based solely on a person's IQ. Although we left for a miriade of reasons, a large complaint I had was that anyone with an IQ less than 120 was considered an "other" or "a lesser". In general, no one had a problem with my registered quotient and I was even accorded some misplaced reverence. That said, what they all hated was my thought that everyone, no matter the intelligence level, has something to offer society in a very positive fashion and should be treated with equal status.

    If each person can conquer their own idea that they are superior to another human being for any reason at all then the root of the problem will die and the visual biases will disappear with it. Is that a viable and possible task?
    Dunno, that answer lays within each of us.
     
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  13. Cody Fousnaugh

    Cody Fousnaugh Very Well-Known Member
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    I don't know about that. A few months ago, I seen a picture online of a young black kid hugging a white cop. That photo was on our local news. But, you are right, mostly showing the worst, not the best.
     
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  14. Cody Fousnaugh

    Cody Fousnaugh Very Well-Known Member
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    One thing I want to say here is, some folks must live in a diverse city with all kinds of diverse food restaurants around, while others don't need (or want) all that diversity around them. That is why some folks desire living in Wyoming, Idaho, North and South Dakota, where the diversity is rather low. I believe that should be left up to the individual of where they want to live, not be criticized for where they want to live. To me, this is a matter of choice and that's all.
     
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  15. Missy Lee

    Missy Lee Well-Known Member
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    Three years ago I would not have posted as I did in the above post. At that time I had and still do have friends that originated from Pakistan....good friends, not just acquaintances. I stayed in their home, was auntie to their kids. They adopted the Canadian lifestyle, you might say they embraced it, in spite of difficulties at first they made an attempt to fit in. We knew the husband first and stayed with him every step of the way through the more than two years it took for him to bring his wife and kids over. What a celebration we had on that happy day.

    Today however, is different. Screening does not take years and the ones coming today still continue in the old ways, will shove you without apology while shopping. Demands for prayer rooms in schools, in the work place, the list is endless.

    And the biggest problem I have is that as a volunteer in a food bank run by a church they make special demands for halal food, if it has pork, they don't want it. Someone want to explain to me how since they have absolutely no Christian faith they can go to a Christian church for a handout. Their own people should, but don't set up a system to help them and believe you me there are plenty of their kind able to lend a helping hand. Instead they leave it to us.
     
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  16. Yvonne Smith

    Yvonne Smith Very Well-Known Member
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    You make a great point, @Missy Lee , and I think that the churches should just hand out whatever food they usually do, and people can either take it or leave it. To go to a religion that believes different than they do and ask for a handout, instead of asking their own church for help is not how it should be, in any case.
    The Muslims follow the Old Testament, at least part of it, and it definitely says we are to take care of our families that are poor; so this should be a part of their church teaching also.
    It would seem to me more likely that they are doing this specifically to make an issue of it, than because they are truly in need of the food help.
     
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  17. Missy Lee

    Missy Lee Well-Known Member
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    Yvonne, I agree, they do it to make an issue. Part of the problem arises with what I call the "Enablers" those who encourage Muslim thoughts of separatism rather then trying to make them understand the need to fit in.

    Our pastor was an enabler. He would bring baskets of food to some of the women who used the excuse of not wanting to visit a food bank in person because they did not have a male to accompany them as he was at work. But yet when I pointed out these same women could go shopping in the company of other women he had no answer other than to tell me that I lacked compassion and understanding.

    I left the church, but took my faith.
     
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  18. Billie Lane

    Billie Lane Member
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    I would like to say that my question has nothing to do with immigration, which I consider a separate issue.
    The recent problems with immigration worldwide may have fueled bigotry in some quarters but immigration alone does not inspire bigotry, nor is it the root of bigotry.
    I think here we have to determine the difference between discrimination and prejudice. Discrimination is an essential tool of analysis.
    Prejudice, whether the product of racial,class or social prejudice fuels bigotry.
    The Jets vs the Sharks is bigotry.
    Being patriotic is not, but patriotism is not a product of religion, colour , gender or whatever. True patriotism is about standards and values.

    The illustration I used has been misunderstood.
    Here we have a group of bigots who have defined themselves as the English Defence League attempting to abuse English nationals. That these nationals are Muslim, Hindu, Scottish Presbyterian ,, jewish, etc , is the point.They are all British Nationals - not immigrants.
    if it was about immigration , the English would be getting all the stick, the Scots, Irish and Welsh inhabited Britain long before the English moved here.
    Much like the Red Indian or Australian Aborigine.
    My question had nothing to do with turf-war and wasn't intended to be seen that way.

    Of course , Immigration needs to be sensibly controlled, but it is not the immigrants fault that it isn't controlled . Politicians are responsible for that particular chaos by not thinking of the consequences of their own policies and the lack of common-sense contingency plans to deal with the situations that may arise when their policies go wrong.That today's western Leaders have never considered the necessity for greater living-space is the root of turf-war.Short-term policies can't produce long term solutions.
    That depends upon forward planning and an eye to the big picture.
    However, none of that was intended to be directly related to the question. Perhaps, I didn't word it very well?
    If so, I apologize for the misunderstanding.

    I have friends of many varying Nationalites and racial origins , but that does not prevent me or them from supporting strong immigration controls.
    Many of the people I work with are British Asians and THEY voted Brexit.
    Politicians and the press use these labels to divide us, but we don't need to.

    To clarify that, to be anti-Immigration is not being anti-immigrant.
     
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  19. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Very Well-Known Member
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    It is true that anti-immigration does not mean anti-immigrant @Billie Lane but the more than obvious feeling of superiority still exists among the home countrymen.
    They are welcome to come in legally and jump through all of the hoops to obtain citizenry, but "leave your customs, ethics, morals, language, laws, clothing and religion behind.".
    Even if and when they have accomplished all of the above, the immigrant is still looked upon as being inferior than the general population.
    In my most humble somewhat objective opinion, full acceptance and equality happens with the advent of a second or even third generation but even then, there is still the problem of racial bias from all sides.

    Now, as of late, there is one prevalent attitude that exists which endangers all races, creeds, sexes and those of faith (or lack thereof) which is the "forceful" approach. It's the act that some individuals or even groups have taken on in order to achieve a larger recognition which is to figuratively snatch people by the nape of the neck demanding that they be not only accepted but liked.
    In my small personal realm, if Anyone demands that I accept everything about a person including their entire culture and baggage, that person will only garner a vehemently terse response. If I am given some time to get to know someone, I will inevitably make a much calmer evaluation leaning more positive than negative.
     
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  20. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    When large groups of people from any one part of the world move to another part of the world, there are going to be problems. I don't know that this is significantly different that some who have come before, except that we're perhaps less able to absorb them today and, more significantly, we have a political environment that does not allow them to become integrated into the society naturally but, instead, seeks to force society to accommodate them.

    The Irish had terrible problems when they immigrated to the United States. They were beaten and even killed, and businesses would put signs out saying that the Irish were not welcome, or that the Irish need not apply. Eventually, they began to integrate into society, a task that began with learning to speak English, and I think it's fair to say today that most Americans couldn't tell an Irish person from anyone else.

    Anti-Semitism has been an American tradition. In fact, much of what Germany did in the 1930s and 1940s was based on things that that were being done in the United States first, only they took it a few steps further. There are still anti-Semites in the United States, I am sure, but those who have wanted to integrate into the society have pretty much managed to to so, while those who have the religious conviction to stand out are able to stand out. Much like the Orthodox Jews, the Old Order Amish have made a decision not to integrate with the rest of society and, while they have gone through periods of heavy discrimination, they are pretty much being used as tourist attractions today. Again though, the only reason they are not fully integrated into society is that they have chosen not to.

    The Chinese went through a lot of discrimination when they came here and, although it was surely before my time, they were treated as if they were not fully human. Now, Chinese is being taught in the public schools as the most important second language to learn. Where they may have had the biggest problems, as far as becoming integrated into American society have been where they have chosen to live amongst amongst themselves rather than to integrate. Again, where they have chosen not to integrate, they have not. We have a couple of Chinese families living in Millinocket and while things might look different from their perspective, I don't know that they're treated any differently than anyone else.

    People have been coming here from Mexico forever, and the problems seem only to take place where they choose to live amongst themselves, to fly the Mexican flag, to speak Spanish rather than English, and to treat our country as if we owed them something. Very few people have problems with Mexicans immigrating to the United States but there are limits as to how many people we can absorb, and those limits are much stricter when they want to absorb us instead.

    Yes, there are enclaves of expatriated Americans living in Mexico, and speaking English, but once their money runs out, they're gone. The Mexican government is not going to accommodate them, and the only reason anyone speaks English to them is that they want their money. They are not part of Mexico, and they certainly haven't been absorbed into Mexican society.

    Setting the increased threat of terrorism aside, the main reason why people have trouble with thousands of people coming here from the Islamic nations is not that they want to remain Muslim; we could accept that. The reason that this is unsustainable is that they are unwilling to be absorbed into American society. Unwilling to accommodate themselves to living in a country whose customs are different, they want us to change to accommodate them, and to do it at our expense.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 16, 2017
  21. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    So very true
     
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  22. Martin Alonzo

    Martin Alonzo Very Well-Known Member
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    If you are Canadian you need to pay your taxes or we will throw you in jail. You better not speed or you might get arrested. You better have all your vaccines or you cannot go to school. All this changes when you are a refugee you do not need a medical check before you enter the country or proof of any kind just your word. Who has more rights in Canada? This is happening in the US as well but not documented. You are a bigot or phobic if you say anything.
    BOMBSHELL: Inside Canada-USA "Refugee" Trafficking Ring
     
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  23. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    I think our current governor changed that, but our last governor - who is now our US Senator (Angus King) instructed the DMV not to require documentation for immigrants seeking a driver's license. Meanwhile, the rules for US citizens were strengthened, requiring two forms of identification.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 18, 2017
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  24. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Very Well-Known Member
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    Hmmm...When I lived in Mexico, it was a laughable common piece of knowledge that there was no such thing as a car without a dent in it.
     
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  25. Gloria Mitchell

    Gloria Mitchell Very Well-Known Member
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