Fossil-free Power - This Is More Like It

Discussion in 'Energy & Fuel' started by Frank Sanoica, Jan 31, 2017.

  1. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    Gargantuan offshore wind turbine crushes record for most energy produced in 24 hours

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    "There’s a massive offshore wind turbine in Østerild, Denmark breaking energy generation records left and right.
    MHI Vestas Offshore Wind — a joint venture between Vestas Wind Systems and Mitsubishi Heavy Industries — showed off its 9 MW turbine prototype in December 2016, an upgrade to its V164-8.0 MW version. The Goliath of wind turbines generated nearly 216,000 kWh over 24 hours during its December test, breaking the previous record for energy generation record for a commercially available offshore wind turbine. To put the numbers in perspective, that’s enough energy to power the average American household for roughly 20 years."

    http://www.digitaltrends.com/cool-tech/denmark-wind-turbine-breaks-records/
     
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  2. Martin Alonzo

    Martin Alonzo Very Well-Known Member
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    I tried wind generators here Frank putting up two but had to take one down because not enough wind.

    Ha Ha
     
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  3. Chrissy Cross

    Chrissy Cross Veteran Member
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    I see quite a few of them when I drive to my daughter's house, around the Pacheco Pass area. It does get windy there for some reason. Before you're about to get on the pass there is always a gusty wind warning and it's usually not too windy anywhere else.

    I can barely keep my car on the road it's so bad sometimes. That's the only time I ever grip the steering wheel so tightly and with both hands.
     
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  4. Chrissy Cross

    Chrissy Cross Veteran Member
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    IMG_0234.JPG Here's a couple pics of them. Weren't taken by me because I'm always driving and I'd go off the road if I took it.

    IMG_0233.JPG
     
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  5. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    @Chrissy Cross
    Thank you! Seems to be rather haphazard the way they situate these things, not in a gridwork or orderly fashion. Must be a reason, I suppose. Presence of a set of blades must break up and divert the natural movement of air, or something. Certainly much has been devoted to figuring these things out. There are vast installations in Texas and New Mexico, along I-40. Some say they create "pollution" in the form of noise. That's one thing I would like to learn more about. IOW, is it true, or instead a means to discredit windpower by the forces which empower fossil fuels.
    Frank
     
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  6. Chrissy Cross

    Chrissy Cross Veteran Member
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    I don't know about the noise because my windows are always up when I'm driving.
     
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  7. Patsy Faye

    Patsy Faye Veteran Member
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    I'm all for these
    Over here we have them out at sea - a lot breezier
     
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  8. Kalvin Mitnic

    Kalvin Mitnic Well-Known Member
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    Off shore when possible or in non settled regions are the best choices. Too close to homes seems unwarranted and cause complaints.
     
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  9. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    True, that!
     
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  10. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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  11. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Very Well-Known Member
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    I am having some difficulty determining which I am more prone to like between nuclear and wind turbines. On one hand, turbines seem to do the job but when I see them plastered all over few thousand acres it almost makes my eyes hurt. What was a beautiful tract of land is now filled with the likes of don Quixote's nemesis.
    On the other hand, nuclear definitely does a great job, but with the risk factor thrown in which could turn a few thousand beautiful acres into a waste land that time has forgotten, I dunno..........!

    But alas, no matter which I like I will have to take the defeatist stance and say it's pretty much out of my hands.
    The small gods that lead politicians and stuff an immeasurable amount of cash into their pockets are they who will win out at the end of the day.

    Now, I do plan on building a generator using neodymium magnets when I have some spare time. The only thing that seems to be "non perpetual" about them is that parts will wear out. Otherwise, the design I am working on in my brain should afford us a continual source of power should our local electric company fail.
     
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  12. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    They've ruined several nice mountains in Maine with those wind turbines, and I can promise you that no one's electricity costs have been reduced. We have dams all over Maine but we've allowed Canadian power companies to buy them up, so we have a power dam just outside of our town limits, yet we're paying extra to have our power transferred from Bangor.
     
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  13. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    @Bobby Cole
    Agreed and understood! Nuclear seems to have done well for France, in particular, with very few, if any, "excursions" of any type. It might be interesting to learn whether fool-proof nuclear reactor design ups the cost of the resulting product by some orders of magnitude. If one is able to produce electric power, say, at home, at essentially no cost beyond initial capital investment and ongoing maintenance, it is easily possible to "feed" power back to the local supplying utility, resulting in the means to pay for those two cost factors mentioned. Electric meters can run in either direction!

    I'm leaning toward superconductivity, myself. Just read today where UK is touting a Tokamak they have built as being nearly ready to produce viable power via nuclear fusion. Methinks they are blowing smoke as usual, under pressure from their funding sources.
    Frank
     
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  14. Ken Anderson

    Ken Anderson Veteran Member
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    If this is true, the uglifying of America's mountains is for nil.

     
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  15. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    @Ken Anderson
    Glad you qualified the post with "If this is true"..... I have no doubt some of the claims stated are true, such as the loss of birds, and possibly the failure of wind persistence. At the same time, stating that a wind generator produces less power over it's lifetime than was required to build it is absurd. No reason exists physically why a generator cannot essentially produce power nearly forever, given adequate maintenance. The structure itself ought to be as lasting as the Pyramids, IMO.

    Granted beautiful mountainous areas ARE uglified by such modification. However, even though the Southwest Deserts are considered to have "beauty", untold millions of acres lie parched by unrelenting winds. Why not erect the damned towers there? If they must be erected at all. Distance to "market" is no longer a valid argument. Line "losses" have now been reduced substantially by new means of utilizing Direct Current at ultra-high voltages, resulting only in conductor resistance losses, no Alternating Current losses at all. That's the argument "for".

    "Against"? Yes, I am. Conversion of Solar Energy, instead of "wind power", directly to electric power is undeniable better, environmentally as well as ecologically; such installations have nearly no effect upon wildlife. Yes, enormous expanses of land must be covered by solar cells, but they are mounted in groups on slender stands, around which the Denizens of the desert can crawl about to their heart's content. Frank
     
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  16. Ted Richards

    Ted Richards Well-Known Member
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    The tremendous wind energy potential of the great plains of the U.S. and Canada is virtually untapped because the electrical grids connecting to the great cities in the East is either missing, inadequate, or obsolete. A critical priority for North America is modern, nation-spanning high-capacity energy grid, preferably hardened against CME or radiation events,

    I mentioned wind energy potential of the Great plains but equally important is the solar energy potential pf the western states all of it unrealized until we have a modern electrical grid.
     
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  17. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Very Well-Known Member
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    @Ted Richards
    I must agree with you, but with reservation. For example, referring to the image:
    [​IMG]
    Mohave Generating Station

    This plant in Laughlin, Nevada, is gone today. It produced way over a billion watts, 1580 Megawatts, was coal-fired, commissioned in 1971, at which time Laughlin was still a nameless non-town. It was shut down in 2005. It's output was delivered via 2 lines of 500,000 volts each. Those lines fed Southern California, primarily. None of the aging parts of the national grid can be used in conjunction with this scale of operation, and it should be noted that many of the newer transmission lines operate on Direct Current, a capability non-existent much more than 25 or so years ago.

    My point is that, the two transmission lines are still in place, marching away across the desert. Plan was to build a Solar Plant on the property and utilize those existing lines.

    "On June 10, 2009, Southern California Edison announced that the Mohave Generating Station would be decommissioned and all generating equipment would be removed from the site. Later, SCE announced that all administrative buildings on site would also be razed. The only structure remaining on the property will be the 500kV switchyard, which will continue to serve as a switching location for the bulk power system as well as provide electricity to a nearby Nevada Power substation supplying the Laughlin area.

    Dismantling got underway in October 2009 and is expected to take 2 years and cost $30 million. About 300 staff lost their jobs when the plant was closed.

    On March 11, 2011, the 500-foot (150 m) exhaust stack, a longtime landmark of the Laughlin/Bullhead City area, was felled by explosives."

    My wife and I happened to be present in the area in 2011 as "snowbirds", and watched the felling of the stack, from a good vantage point. The information quoted is from this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohave_Power_Station#Shutdown
    Frank
     
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